tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18902745.post1350084311651897011..comments2024-03-24T15:19:06.377-04:00Comments on The Continuum: Follow up to the most recent post on Richard HookerFr. Robert Harthttp://www.blogger.com/profile/05892141425033196616noreply@blogger.comBlogger8125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18902745.post-84183620492663776912009-08-13T13:47:22.762-04:002009-08-13T13:47:22.762-04:00Fr. Steve, The Eastern Orthodox view does see the ...Fr. Steve, The Eastern Orthodox view does see the sacred in all of life by virtue of the original blessing of creation. However, what you seem to be saying applies more to Quakers than to the Orthodox. The difference involves metaphysical understandings which underpin Orthodox theology. Without these fine distinctions,there would be little difference between the Orthodox and Quaker view of sacraments.Alice C. Linsleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13069827354696169270noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18902745.post-54598323948243843392009-08-13T09:10:33.683-04:002009-08-13T09:10:33.683-04:00Good points, Ed and Fr. Steve. Indeed, is there a...Good points, Ed and Fr. Steve. Indeed, is there any aspect of the Church in its essence, as a divine, not a human organism, in which godhead is not converted into flesh, but manhood taken up into God, in which the sacraments are properly seen as an extension of the Incarnation, that is not sacramental (with a small "s")? Would it even be possible for the Great Sacraments to be offered in a non-sacramental context? T.S. Eliot, when asked with amused contempt by Virginia Woolf why he went to church, said, "To get closer to God." What could be more sacramental than that? Hence, too, throughout our liturgies, from start to finish, indeed throughout the life of the Church, there really are no "second-class citizens," just different organs in the same divine body, all enlivened, knit together, and sustaining and enriching each other through the indwelling power of the Holy Spirit.<br /><br />Ste. Thérèse of Lisieux would heartily concur with the Orthodox belief, Fr. Steve.Millo Shawnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18902745.post-81748166633236266892009-08-13T00:25:51.267-04:002009-08-13T00:25:51.267-04:00Every time we go through one of these events I hav...Every time we go through one of these events I have further reason to be glad that Lamb's Tales from Shakespeare was shelved so close to my assigned seat in the Second Grade. It lured me into the stories and the stories into the actual plays and then the poems. With that background the Authorized Version and Book of Common Prayer were naturals as were all of the other writers of that period.<br /><br />Charles, unfortunately, has never got past the question of the language and the view point of those who so easily took positions of trust in the Elizabethan Church, but were determined to undermine it for what they were so fond of in Zurich and Geneva.<br /><br />The reason any army makes you wear the uniform and attend and participate in formations is to give you a sense of your part in the whole. Elizabeth understood that even if many of those she had to take for bishops when her sisters refused her did not - and would not. Charles need to read Malcolm MacColl, Canon Dart, and 'Elizabeth and the English Reformation' and re-think his position.Canon Tallishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05182884929479435751noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18902745.post-26397916638292588132009-08-12T20:48:38.831-04:002009-08-12T20:48:38.831-04:00Going off of what Ed said, I rather like the Easte...Going off of what Ed said, I rather like the Eastern Orthodox view that life itself is a Sacrament, and should be lived as such.Fr. Stevehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16869676716891199486noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18902745.post-72569842522585128822009-08-12T15:26:01.028-04:002009-08-12T15:26:01.028-04:00It seems that before we discuss Anglican theology ...<i>It seems that before we discuss Anglican theology we must first teach folks to read English, especially 16th century English.</i><br /><br />How very true. Here is a perfect example: Examining the words of Article XXV a little more: "...have not like nature..." The 16th century writers employed economy of words, so they did not throw in the word "like" because they liked it. Not like ...what? Not like Baptism and the Lord's Supper. Not like in what way? The answer is in the rest of the sentence itself: "For that they have not any visible sign or ceremony ordained of God." This too I expounded on in the original essay (see the link at the top).Fr. Robert Harthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05892141425033196616noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18902745.post-79753173541092454992009-08-12T13:28:05.042-04:002009-08-12T13:28:05.042-04:00It seems that before we discuss Anglican theology ...It seems that before we discuss Anglican theology we must first teach folks to read English, especially 16th century English. It also helps to have some Latin since the Articles are only definitive in their Latin text.<br /><br />But the major problem is that we must deal with those who want to read our documents through the eyes of those to whom they were unacceptable because they did not embrace the full teaching and inventions of the continental 'Reformers.' When you step away from that view then you can see and understand what is so plainly stated.<br /><br />When you have read the medieval theologians you should know that the number of 'sacraments' as enumerated by various writers varied widely. The things which we so called were finally reduced to those we now think of while many of the others were reduced to the status of 'sacramentals' or simply dropped. It is good to have someone who can explain this so clearly.Canon Tallishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05182884929479435751noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18902745.post-73472923901658733742009-08-12T08:54:27.010-04:002009-08-12T08:54:27.010-04:002 sacraments "of the Gospel"
5 sacramen...2 sacraments "of the Gospel"<br /><br />5 sacraments "commonly so called" by ancient and continuing usage in the Church.<br /><br />??? unlimited number of other practices that could easily (though not "officially") be said to meet some or all of the conditions to be sacraments.<br /><br />What could be easier to understand?<br /><br />My tendency has long been to expand, rather than limit the range of the concept "sacrament".<br /><br />If the more "Protestant-minded" wish to insist upon there being ONLY two sacraments, I would ask them to show me where the Bible makes such a definition, or even mentions the term.<br /><br />edpoetreaderhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11613032927883843078noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18902745.post-41026531227968329102009-08-12T05:40:10.952-04:002009-08-12T05:40:10.952-04:00To be honest, when I first read Article XXV, I tho...To be honest, when I first read Article XXV, I thought it meant what Charlie said it meant. That was quite a hurdle for me to get over. In the end, it was an explanation similar to Fr. Hart's that made me realize that Article XXV was not really a hurdle at all. The hurdle was the faulty interpretation of XXV.RC Colanoreply@blogger.com